tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post7601331328542943977..comments2023-10-12T02:21:40.102-07:00Comments on English Historical Fiction Authors: Medieval Bathing for Cleanliness, Health and SexDebra Brownhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03256313302199653185noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-83680337776725800462016-01-21T21:25:56.820-08:002016-01-21T21:25:56.820-08:00This is an interesting post about Medieval bathing...This is an interesting post about Medieval bathing. I like the information you have given. Thanks for sharing and keep up the good work.<br /><a href="http://www.herbal-health-product.com" rel="nofollow">Shifa e Ajwa Paste</a>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00154357402861078045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-61928623322066305712014-01-21T11:14:50.446-08:002014-01-21T11:14:50.446-08:00Hi Scott, that is very interesting. Thank you!Hi Scott, that is very interesting. Thank you!Debra Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03256313302199653185noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-61202526347223144422014-01-21T02:19:31.350-08:002014-01-21T02:19:31.350-08:00Excellent post indeed! We did various research on ...Excellent post indeed! We did various research on medieval bathing for our history of the showers infographic which can be found here http://www.plumbworld.co.uk/the-history-of-the-shower very surprising 1350BC there were findings of bathrooms!Scott Morrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11277574753104206547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-17341424140174052572012-08-28T09:56:51.757-07:002012-08-28T09:56:51.757-07:00Description of the illustration Or one could share...Description of the illustration Or one could share… /bath02.jpg<br /><br />This is not the medieval! <br />Guillaume Vrelant or Willem Vrelant, the author of this illustration (Frontispiece of Book IX by Valère Maxime), was a Dutch Renaissance book illuminator. He was already active in Utrecht in 1450, where he created the Hours of William de Montfort. From 1454 to 1481 he is recorded as a member of the Bruges guild of bookmakers. His large and productive workshop produced (among others) a book of hours which is now in Baltimore (1455–60), the Hours of Isabella of Castille (c.1460), the Chronicles of Hainaut (1468) and individual miniatures in the Hours of Mary of Burgundy (c.1480). <br />Valerius Maximus was a Latin writer and author of a collection of historical anecdotes. He worked during the reign of Tiberius (14 AD to 37 AD). The style of Valerius's writings seems to indicate that he was a professional rhetorician. In his preface he intimates that his work is intended as a commonplace book of historical anecdotes for use in the schools of rhetoric, where the pupils were trained in the art of embellishing speeches by references to history. According to the manuscripts, its title is Nine Books of Memorable Deeds and Sayings. The stories are loosely and irregularly arranged, each book being divided into sections, and each section bearing as its title the topic, most commonly some virtue or vice, or some merit or demerit, which the stories in the section are intended to illustrate.<br />Most of the tales are from Roman history, but each section has an appendix consisting of extracts from the annals of other peoples, principally the Greeks. The exposition exhibits strongly the two currents of feeling which are intermingled by almost every Roman writer of the Empire—the feeling that the Romans of the writer's own day are degenerate creatures when confronted with their own republican predecessors, and the feeling that, however degenerate, the latter-day Romans still tower above the other peoples of the world, and in particular are morally superior to the Greeks.<br />The author's chief sources are Cicero, Livy, Sallust and Pompeius Trogus, especially the first two. Valerius's treatment of his material is careless and unintelligent in the extreme; but in spite of his contusions, contradictions and anachronisms, the excerpts are apt illustrations, from the rhetorician's point of view, of the circumstance or quality they were intended to illustrate. And even on the historical side we owe something to Valerius. He often used sources now lost, and where he touches on his own time he affords us some glimpses of the much debated and very imperfectly recorded reign of Tiberius.<br />He is also a typical example of Silver Latin, a literary period often criticised for poor writers. <br /><br />Zbigniew RabsztynAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-11133783249633273722012-05-03T06:11:32.665-07:002012-05-03T06:11:32.665-07:00This is an interesting post about Medieval bathing...This is an interesting post about Medieval bathing. I like the information you have given. Thanks for sharing and keep up the good work.Katyhttp://www.britishcondoms.co.uk/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-67866475499175314422012-05-01T11:38:23.433-07:002012-05-01T11:38:23.433-07:00"The odor was -- imagine cat spray concentrat..."The odor was -- imagine cat spray concentrated to the density of lard and you will have it." <br /><br />With respect hardly a "the haunting sweet aroma of civet" then! It really doesn't smell at all nice even if heavily diluted, it is used as a fixative of other nice fragrant stuff.Charlie Farrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08134083309643455404noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-11354577502223631742012-04-30T14:01:25.950-07:002012-04-30T14:01:25.950-07:00Hmm, this issue of soaps seems to have kicked up q...Hmm, this issue of soaps seems to have kicked up quite a discussion. I'm aware of the ashes and fat soaps anciently used but, having made them in third grade, I'm in agreement with those who consider them something to which one might not willingly expose tender flesh, and this article is not about laundry but about bathing. <br /><br />In addition to soapwort, sweet woodruff and a number of other herbs have been used as a laundering compound; in fact a book could be written on laundering substances through the ages. But this is an article of limited space on bathing, and perhaps I should not have mentioned laundry at all. <br /><br />Charlie, regarding civet, in the 1970's I had a lovely perfume of civet (one of those little boutique-y bottles not commercially made but the apparent handiwork of a craft person.) It ceased to be made and I complained of this to a friend who was a chemist at a major detergent manufacturing company. He soon gave me a present of two canister (the size of containers for old camera film) of civet paste (this was before buying and selling civet was illegal.) The odor was -- imagine cat spray concentrated to the density of lard and you will have it. <br /><br />My friend was quite perplexed by my stated liking for anything civet and experimented with the substance. Trying various solvents (that would have been available in medieval times -- as that was the whole point of the exercise) he eventually produced a sweet musky scent very like my perfume -- with no other scenting agent. Sometimes life experience is very helpful. Civet was a popular though expensive scent in the Middle Ages, and continued to be available even here in the US (at Kiehl's Pharmacy for example) until the late 1970's.Katherine Ashehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12487069502818472478noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-27651536817753213002012-04-30T07:04:35.542-07:002012-04-30T07:04:35.542-07:00That is true about soap as we now know it, but bat...That is true about soap as we now know it, but bathing soap and recipes for soap existed in GB prior to the mid 13th century. Your wonderful blog merely needed a tweak for clarification when it said twice that soap wasn't invented until the mid-13th century. Certainly no one wants misinformation about out there. especially on a site like this where there is great factual research and information.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-39058420703457490162012-04-30T06:51:54.154-07:002012-04-30T06:51:54.154-07:00I think you'll find that far from being a &quo...I think you'll find that far from being a "haunting sweet aroma", civet smells disgustingly faecal. Like other animal fixatives (like musk from the deer) it comes from the anal glands, in this case of the civet cat. Unsurprisingly it is not used for its fragrance but as a fixative to stop the volatile oils evaporating from the fragrant essential oils. This is why it's so difficult to get rid of the smell of a cat spraying around your house! <br /><br />Galen talks of soaps made of lye in the 2nd century AD. Tallow and ashes soaps were very alkaline and were replaced by 'Castile' type soaps developed using olive oil and precipitating out more of the corrosive parts. These were the solid soaps imported from Islamic Spain in the 12th century. Alkali is Arabic for ashes.<br /><br />The roots of the plant soapwort were commonly used for cleansing both people and clothes until soaps were mass produced, both because it was free and because it is very gentle. Textiles conservators still use it to clean heritage fabrics, tapestries, hangings etc.Charlie Farrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08134083309643455404noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-65832443266479880982012-04-30T00:30:33.465-07:002012-04-30T00:30:33.465-07:00Great post - really interesting and just the perio...Great post - really interesting and just the period I am wanting to learn more about! P xAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-73125481662165499282012-04-29T21:54:44.151-07:002012-04-29T21:54:44.151-07:00I loved this article but I have a book that descri...I loved this article but I have a book that describes a very soft kind of soap from early medieval times and will check later.Carol McGrathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11072696398820339640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-28993696518344290852012-04-29T18:24:09.217-07:002012-04-29T18:24:09.217-07:00Regarding the issue of ancient soaps, there were c...Regarding the issue of ancient soaps, there were compounds of various sorts for laundering and general cleaning, but they were rather irritating for skin cleansing. There was even a dry cleaning compound for wool and fine fabrics, but soap as we use it for bathing is descended from the more gentle olive oil Spanish soaps.Katherine Ashehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12487069502818472478noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-28876715161708213102012-04-29T17:28:53.291-07:002012-04-29T17:28:53.291-07:00Very cool! I love the luxury of those bath houses...Very cool! I love the luxury of those bath houses with their tables of wine etc. I was never fooled by the legendary lack of hygiene because most people want to be clean.<br /><br />Thanks for sharing!Sophia Rosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07909417504496472472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-69536134318423729542012-04-29T14:47:16.624-07:002012-04-29T14:47:16.624-07:00Great blog. But soap was available in Britain lon...Great blog. But soap was available in Britain long before the Thirteenth Century and dates back to 2800 BCE. Spanish soap, olive oil based rather than animal fat based, is the soap referred to as invented/available in Thirteenth Century. <br /><br />Refer to this university museum link for correct information. http://www.smith.edu/hsc/museum/ancient_inventions/hsc07b.htm <br /><br />The bathing information in this blog is great. Just some confusion regarding the date on the invention of soap, which has many ancient documentations of soap recipes in different regions and societies.<br /><br />It so important to keep historical research information accurate.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-74236273964687567192012-04-29T10:44:35.556-07:002012-04-29T10:44:35.556-07:00My research has shown that the Celts invented soap...My research has shown that the Celts invented soap and introduced it to the Romans (long before the 13th century Spanish). This fact is cited in many sources, including Kevin Duffy's "Who Were the Celts?" and is usually attributed to Pliny's writings.Nicole Evelinahttp://nicoleevelina.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-18225689488116400802012-04-29T07:57:13.930-07:002012-04-29T07:57:13.930-07:00Fascinating! Thanks for the post!Fascinating! Thanks for the post!Emery Leehttp://authoremerylee.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2456802468539868519.post-65904385696655960842012-04-29T05:23:42.048-07:002012-04-29T05:23:42.048-07:00Excellent article. I really enjoyed it. It`s great...Excellent article. I really enjoyed it. It`s great to get these pockets of knowledge and insight into areas where, you realise, you only had the vaguest notion. Thanks!John wheatleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16053894013613294047noreply@blogger.com